The Barclays Premier League Thread 2013/14

[Colly]

I was bored very early on.

[Gazz]

I know it's fun to bash United, and I know in terms of heritage and achievements they're similar, but globally, United are such a bigger brand. And Liverpool never attracted a player of Mata's calibre in their time at the club. I don't know how it's gonna pan out, but to completely write them off with comparisons to Liverpool is silly. Liverpool, for example, still haven't won The Premier League. With or without CL, United are a huge name in football, and that will count for something.

Also people keep saying United are the biggest 'brand,' but that came about because of their success. Take that away, and the 'brand' collapses.

He was talking about Newcastle, the best 'United' in the country.

[Adam]

I know it's fun to bash United, and I know in terms of heritage and achievements they're similar, but globally, United are such a bigger brand. And Liverpool never attracted a player of Mata's calibre in their time at the club. I don't know how it's gonna pan out, but to completely write them off with comparisons to Liverpool is silly. Liverpool, for example, still haven't won The Premier League. With or without CL, United are a huge name in football, and that will count for something.

One of the few reasonable posts by a non-Man Utd fan made in the last couple of pages, this.

Was it Nerf who said the pull of United before was "just Fergie"? Come on. Man Utd are indeed one of the biggest brands in world football, right up there with Real Madrid and Barcelona. To suggest that that will evaporate overnight because they finish 6th for one year is ludicrous.They have been the best team in this country for a sustained period of 20 years and that does not count for nothing. I would love to revisit this debate if Toni Kroos actually does join United in the summer, because it is definitely a possibility and Kroos has intimated as much himself in interviews recently. United will still be able to attract high calibre players if they finish 6th. It's if they continue to fail to make the top 4 in subsequent years that it will become very hard for them to keep up.

I'm fairly well certain that Torres signed for Liverpool right after they got to the final of the Champions League and were still in it. So I'm not sure why people are bringing him up as an example. And people are acting like Suarez came to Liverpool as some down-and-out bad boy with a sullied reputation. He was rightly classed as one of the best strikers in Europe at the time, fresh off the back of a superb World Cup showing (handball aside) and had a strike rate approaching a goal a game for Ajax. He was a huge signings easily comparable to United signing Mata.

This whole discussion has been dumb. And I hate Man Utd ordinarily.

[Lineker]

Seven match ban for Pardew. First three of those are complete stadium bans.

[METALMAN]

That's the same as 1.4 quenelles. Or 0.7 bites of Branislav Ivanovic.

[stokeriño]

That young lad by the name of Wulfert Cornelius van Ginkel has resumed training with the senior Chelsea squad this week, less than six months after he suffered an ACL tear against Swindon Town in the Capital One Cup. Indeed, WCvG (or MvG, if we must defer to his more commonly-known/boring name) is quoted as saying "I have absolutely no problems with my knee" in De Telegraaf.

Damn he heals fast.

[Jimmy]

Kaboul's had his red card rescinded.

[EddieG]

That young lad by the name of Wulfert Cornelius van Ginkel has resumed training with the senior Chelsea squad this week, less than six months after he suffered an ACL tear against Swindon Town in the Capital One Cup. Indeed, WCvG (or MvG, if we must defer to his more commonly-known/boring name) is quoted as saying "I have absolutely no problems with my knee" in De Telegraaf.

Damn he heals fast.

Michael Van Gerwen?

[stokeriño]

Take your darts players away from this place.

[Nerf]

I know it's fun to bash United, and I know in terms of heritage and achievements they're similar, but globally, United are such a bigger brand. And Liverpool never attracted a player of Mata's calibre in their time at the club. I don't know how it's gonna pan out, but to completely write them off with comparisons to Liverpool is silly. Liverpool, for example, still haven't won The Premier League. With or without CL, United are a huge name in football, and that will count for something.

One of the few reasonable posts by a non-Man Utd fan made in the last couple of pages, this.

Was it Nerf who said the pull of United before was "just Fergie"? Come on. Man Utd are indeed one of the biggest brands in world football, right up there with Real Madrid and Barcelona. To suggest that that will evaporate overnight because they finish 6th for one year is ludicrous.They have been the best team in this country for a sustained period of 20 years and that does not count for nothing. I would love to revisit this debate if Toni Kroos actually does join United in the summer, because it is definitely a possibility and Kroos has intimated as much himself in interviews recently. United will still be able to attract high calibre players if they finish 6th. It's if they continue to fail to make the top 4 in subsequent years that it will become very hard for them to keep up.

I'm fairly well certain that Torres signed for Liverpool right after they got to the final of the Champions League and were still in it. So I'm not sure why people are bringing him up as an example. And people are acting like Suarez came to Liverpool as some down-and-out bad boy with a sullied reputation. He was rightly classed as one of the best strikers in Europe at the time, fresh off the back of a superb World Cup showing (handball aside) and had a strike rate approaching a goal a game for Ajax. He was a huge signings easily comparable to United signing Mata.

This whole discussion has been dumb. And I hate Man Utd ordinarily.

For the third time, Torres is being brought up as an example because United were (and are) still in the Champions League when they signed Mata. And you totally missed my point. I said that United are one of the biggest brands in football BECAUSE of their success, most of which is down to Fergie. If you take their success away, as is very likely to happen under Moyes, then there is no brand left. Hell, the glory hunter fans are already jumping ship. Nobody said it'd happen overnight, though.

[METALMAN]

I said that United are one of the biggest brands in football BECAUSE of their success, most of which is down to Fergie. If you take their success away, as is very likely to happen under Moyes, then there is no brand left.

But how do you know this? How can you prove what will or won't affect Man Utd's brand with such certainty?

The whole argument is a load of nonsense. There's nothing you can provide except guesswork.

[stokeriño]

I do remember reading an article at some point that was written off the back of several years' worth of surveys regarding teams and their popularity on other continents (especially Asia, also the USA etc.) and it noted that trophies and success in general had by far the largest influence over those fans' allegiances. It also noted that said fans were much more open to change their supported club depending on said success than those in the home nation.

Not very helpful without being able to find said article again, but I do believe that the overseas/global 'brand' of United and other clubs will ebb if met with prolonged periods without success. Obviously this would not happen instantly either.

[EddieG]

I said that United are one of the biggest brands in football BECAUSE of their success, most of which is down to Fergie. If you take their success away, as is very likely to happen under Moyes, then there is no brand left.

But how do you know this? How can you prove what will or won't affect Man Utd's brand with such certainty?

The whole argument is a load of nonsense. There's nothing you can provide except guesswork.

The example I can think of is Leeds, sure, they weren't winning premier leagues, but they were somewhat succesful, and nearly everyone I knew back in Doncaster was a Leeds fan (or one of the Sheffield teams) kinda depends on when they were born and who was doing better in the premier league.. then the younger people who started following football mid-2000s, are supporting Doncaster because of Leeds lack of success.

[Colly]

:/

[Plubby]

I said that United are one of the biggest brands in football BECAUSE of their success, most of which is down to Fergie. If you take their success away, as is very likely to happen under Moyes, then there is no brand left.

But how do you know this? How can you prove what will or won't affect Man Utd's brand with such certainty?

The whole argument is a load of nonsense. There's nothing you can provide except guesswork.

The example I can think of is Leeds, sure, they weren't winning premier leagues, but they were somewhat succesful, and nearly everyone I knew back in Doncaster was a Leeds fan (or one of the Sheffield teams) kinda depends on when they were born and who was doing better in the premier league.. then the younger people who started following football mid-2000s, are supporting Doncaster because of Leeds lack of success.

Leeds is a reasonable comparable, but they still had a strong following until the backside dropped completely out of Leeds.

Man United will still enjoy a strong following and will still be a destination of choice for at least a little while after they fall away from CL. It'll only be if that's prolonged or if they get relegated that it will affect them the way it did Leeds.

[Gazz]

How's Pardiola getting around the stadium ban then?

My money is on Sports Direct Blimp.

[Colly]

Our first goal in the U18s game against Chelsea last night was an absolutely blatant punch into the back of the net, well worth youtubing as the coverage is from Chelsea tv, 'I hope we win 94-1 now'.

We lost, deservedly so after that.

[Lineker]

Sherwood has told the Spurs players that a lot of them are 'playing for their futures'. Nothing to do with your shit tactics, Tim!

Elsewhere, Southampton have named Canadian Ralph Krueger as their new chairman following Nicola Cortese's departure in January. Krueger, who was a consultant to Canada's gold medal ice hockey team at the 2014 Winter Olympics, first took a seat on the Saints board last month. The 54-year-old, who has never worked in football, will be joined at St Mary's by new director Hans Hofstetter.

And Ozil is out for a few weeks with a hamstring injury he suffered last night.

[Lineker]

Eric Cantona has been arrested in London following reports of an assault.

[Szumi]

Any Americans on here planning on going to any of the International Champions Cup games featuring some of the Prem teams? The Liverpool/City game just had tickets go on sale; can't wait to see Liverpool play again.