*SPOILERS* The Dark Knight *SPOILERS*

[zero]

DMN, that's been thrown out for awhile amongst various forums... I think it may have even sprung up in here a few times. I'd definitely be for it and I could see it working as long as they make him just a mobster, rather than a mutated freak.

[Protoman Version 2.5]

About that, DMN...

Spoiler: Click here to view

It was rumored Phillip was going to cameo as the Penguin in Dark Knight before the movie came out. There was even some steam behind it with a leaked script with some name changes listing one character some thing along the lines of "Iceberg". Then in one of the photos for the viral marketing there was a ad in it for the "Iceberg" club, the place owned by the Penguin. It was later dismissed by Nolan and as we see, no Penguin in the Dark Knight.

Though I think the character could still work, as a main baddie with the mobsters behind him? Naw, for the very same reasons that Black Mask or Scarecrow couldn't work as a movie carrying opposite to Batman, they are just barely above the mobs & gangs. However, Penguin as a side character that owns the night club as a front for his dirty dealings & informant for Batman as he became later on in the comics? That I could see working really well and adding another element to the movies.

For those that cry for realism, you don't need to make the Penguin...Danny Devito. Make him short, fat, wear suits and carry around a umbrella (tricked out or not), and boom, there you go. If the constant wearing of tuxs weren't enough to warrant his nickname, give Oswald a beakish nose like some people have without going over board with it. No need for the weird hands or bird cries or circus freak background, ect.

Pretty much the only character off the top of my head I can't see taking a realistic approach with is Mr. Freeze. But even Zero provided a some what interesting solution to the problems he as a character creates.

[DMN in the House]

Yeah. I think he'd have to have a bit of 'freak' in him to fit in the current theme of the movies, but maybe even something as simple as the umbrellas and a tuxedo could make it work. I think the listed actor would be perfect to pull it off. I'd also love to see Depp as The Riddler (I know I said that before), and not in the role of The Joker.

Batman's Rogues Gallery has so many guys in it, people need to stop saying 'oh, not realistic', and actually think about how they could be twisted and molded into fitting into a more 'realistic' world. I mean, even a guy like Freeze could be worked with in some form, if you really wanted to go there. I'm not sure I would, just because doing so would probably change the character to much, but if you can run with Poison Ivy as a eco-terrorist, you really see where things can go.

Plus, once you bring out The Joker, you open up room for some of the more outlandish things, just tweaked. People need to be more imaginative.

EDIT: Damn Proto, we pretty much said the same damn things

I'm very excited about the future of this franchise, especially if Nolan stays on. People need to stop shooting ideas down, because, like I said, if you can do The Joker, you can do 99% of the other guys.

Edited July 20, 2008 by DMN

[AnnIQ Edison]

I haven't seen Batman yet but hopefully (if I can convince my stupid friends to see it over Get Smart. I know...kill me now) I should be seeing it tomorrow.

I think that video says it all and speaks for everyone in the last couple of days

[TheReaper316]

I really have nothing bad to say about the film. I was the best comic movie ever done, and a 5 star movie outside of comics. I think its a Best Picture nominee for sure.

Spoiler: Click here to view

I dont want to see the Joker back, unless its small scenes from the Asylum that you dont see his face. They could come up with a decent replacement voice, but not performance. Id rather it just be left as it is than try to reinstall someone new. This series hasnt been tarnished yet with recasting or throwing too much stuff in.. besides Gyllenhall. Id like to see Two Face come back as the major villain for a huge triolgy finale, if nothing else.

EDIT: Two things though..why did Joker have 2 stories for how he got his scars? And I might not have looked at it right but did Dent kill someone after he got the wrong flip of the coin?

Edited July 20, 2008 by The Dark Teej
We had a deal about spoilers being in spoiler tags until next weekend.

[Kyle_]

Spoiler: Click here to view

He killed the mobster's driver

[RoyWill Rumble]

The Joker had two stories about his scars because it's just another way to show he has no real backstory or history. Plus, it makes him all the more mysterious and unsettling. He's untraceable, basically. This Joker was at least partially based off of The Joker from The Killing Joke from what I remember, and The Joker from The Killing Joke "makes his own backstory up every day" to paraphrase.

Fuck, I can't remember the quote exactly, but The Joker says something like "Sometimes I remember it one way, sometimes another. If I'm going to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice."

That's from The Killing Joke, and they basically take that approach in the movie. The Joker doesn't have a past really

Spoiler: Click here to view

(fuck, he doesn't even have fingerprints or DNA that can be tracked)

and it seems he doesn't want to remember it, because he doesn't want to face up to his past. That's probably me just reading into it too much, but it seems he's forgotten his past, doesn't want to make it an excuse for his insanity, so he just spews bullshit and lives his chaotic life, reinventing himself (his past included) every single day. That's just classic The Joker.

And maybe the whole scars things should be in spoilers. I dunno.

Edited July 20, 2008 by Will.

[zero]

Yes, the official word from DC is all Joker backstories are accepted because "that's how he remembers it at the time."

And unless I missed it, I haven't seen it posted yet - The Dark Knight broke Spider-Man 3's opening weekend record of $150 million by making $155 million this weekend. So it now has the biggest opening weekend in the history of American cinema.

Edited July 20, 2008 by Zero

[EndOfAnEra]

Amazing movie, and Ledger's Joker is my new favorite villian. He got the crowd so tense whenever he was on screen, and then when he would do something, he would get cheered.

It is dissapointing to know I'll never see Ledger in that role, but I would love to see them give someone else a shot at The Joker character. Remember how everyone shat on the idea of Ledger as Joker? I want to see them bring someone like that in again. Maybe not right away, but a movie or two down the line.

Regarding Two Face:

Spoiler: Click here to view

If they don't bring him back, I'll be dissapointed. I told everyone I was with that I figured the plan was for Harvey to be locked up in Arkham with his death being hidden so that they can try to save him. This would then lead to Dent going ABSOLUTELY nuts, rather than just out for revenge. Everyone was saying he's dead blah blah, but I don't think he actually is. He just fell. There's still so much they can do to build that character, and that gives the possibility of Eckhart giving a whole new dynamic to that character.

[Fitzy]

Wow and damn what an awesome movie.

Spoiler: Click here to view

I am sure I am just repeating what others have said. But Heath Ledger was brilliant in this movie. He'll forever be remembered as Joker. I loved his magic trick, it was wonderful. The scene at the jail where he just kept wanting his one phone call was awesome. Riding away in the cop car with his head out the window was funny. He just completely owned every scene he was in. Just awesome.

[Krone]

Regarding Rachel, and what I think is her future and a possible future plot that I thought of.

Spoiler: Click here to view

I believe that she didn't really get killed and instead, Joker was just fucking around with Batman and Two Face much like both of them did with Commissioner Gordon who they made the Joker think was dead. Somehow, I am hoping that we end up finding out that Rachael was actually in a third environment the entire time and Joker knew that Batman was going for Dent, so he rigged all three of the places (Dent's place, the warehouse, and Rachael's actual location) with explosives, but was only going to detonate both Dent's place and the throw off for Rachael.

Maybe it would be cool if in the next one, Rachael goes all psychotic on Batman for killing Harvey, because it was him that she actually loved, so instead of Joker coming back, we could have a link to the Joker in the form of Rachael.

[Toe]

Why couldn't you make Mr. Freeze a realistic villian? I don't think he should be used, but you could make him a murderer who does experiments on people and then kills them like Dexter's brother in Dexter. I am not saying they should do that - it was done in Dexter - but that is just one idea.

[Protoman Version 2.5]

Yeah. I think he'd have to have a bit of 'freak' in him to fit in the current theme of the movies, but maybe even something as simple as the umbrellas and a tuxedo could make it work. I think the listed actor would be perfect to pull it off. I'd also love to see Depp as The Riddler (I know I said that before), and not in the role of The Joker.

Batman's Rogues Gallery has so many guys in it, people need to stop saying 'oh, not realistic', and actually think about how they could be twisted and molded into fitting into a more 'realistic' world. I mean, even a guy like Freeze could be worked with in some form, if you really wanted to go there. I'm not sure I would, just because doing so would probably change the character to much, but if you can run with Poison Ivy as a eco-terrorist, you really see where things can go.

Plus, once you bring out The Joker, you open up room for some of the more outlandish things, just tweaked. People need to be more imaginative.

EDIT: Damn Proto, we pretty much said the same damn things

I'm very excited about the future of this franchise, especially if Nolan stays on. People need to stop shooting ideas down, because, like I said, if you can do The Joker, you can do 99% of the other guys.

I wouldn't even say that the Joker is the most out landish character they've taken a realistic twist on. Ra's al Ghul was a immortal that has lived for thousands(/millions, it varies from story to story) of years and has in that time built a underground black market empire. Not exactly a story that has its foot firmly placed within the realms of our every day world. Yet they didn't address certain aspects of the character (without flat out denying them, Ra's even teasing Bruce of whether he was immortal or not in Begins at the party) and it worked, very well.

Just like I've seen some dismiss the Riddler as a future bad guy, a guy running around & stealing things and leaving clues in their place? Yeah, no, that wouldn't work out at all and would be rather campy. But to make him what Nolan suggested

Spoiler: Click here to view

a hacker for all intents & purposes

, that could go some where. Would it be killings on the scale of the Joker? Probably not but it could cause mass panic in Gotham as most things now (and especially in the slightly "in the near future" Gotham) are run by computer. Things start going wrong, bank accounts emptying, trains' schedules going hay wired & some colliding, planes crashing, car accidents by stop lights being altered, ect, all the while little riddles being the only thing the Riddler leaves behind (almost mocking the police & others to try and get him). And, the more I think about it, the more I actually do like the idea of Depp as Riddler better than Joker. Plus as a side note, with that gimmick in the movie...the viral marketing pretty much writes itself ().

I mean, I'll throw out another example of the rogue's gallery that with a little tweaking could work (in a minor role similar to Scarecrow's in DK), Killer Croc. Big mutant guy that looks like a lizard doesn't work, for obvious reasons. But a big guy who is muscle for hired (as Croc was pretty much in the comics) who is into body modification & tattoos and under goes heavy body art & plastic surgery to attain what he wants (that "lizardish" look some people have in real life), boom, Killer Croc (explains where his name comes from even).

Also Reaper...

Spoiler: Click here to view

That was the point, Joker told two different stories of how he got his scars because its implied even he doesn't know who he is any more. His mind is constantly changing who he is of his own whim and he refuses or just doesn't care to face his actual past, whatever it may be. This image of a walking enigmatic chaos was further put over when Gordon said they couldn't find matches for his prints or even his DNA.

Which, is partially why the more I think about it, the more I actually kinda like the idea of the Joker constantly being recasted. He changes so much in the comics and his appearance while it stays a basic outline, changes just as much due to various artists drawing him. Each actor could bring some thing new to him without having to measure up to Heath's performance or god forbid, having to TOP it. They could do their own things, just as Heath did and it could stay within the realm of the character's personality and that's kinda the beauty of the Joker. He can be nearly any thing you need him to be.

As DMN said, I'm oddly even more pumped about the franchise than I was after I saw Begins (which left me really excited as both was it a great movie & it teased my favorite, the Joker coming back to the big screen). Because if Nolan stays on, it means most of the cast stays on (Bale, Freeman, Gary, Michael, ect) which has helped carry the workload of these movies. As well as Nolan has taken both pieces in such different directions & feels (while managing to make them feel like part of the same story and not feel disjointed or like different films entirely such as the earlier franchise did), proving he could do the same with what's to come. There's over fifty years worth of comics of Batman the Nolans can tap into and morph to bring it to reality, and it is both amazing (and kinda sad) they are the first ones with the movies to really get they can do that with Batman (and that people want to see it).

[RoyWill Rumble]

Spoiler: Click here to view

Sorry to say, but the whole Rachel going psychotic thing is fucking stupid to me, and doesn't follow the Batman canon at allllllllllllllll. Unless they bring in Catwoman as Batman's love interest (which I hope they don't), Rachel ought to stay as Batman's only love interest, if she's even in the third movie. Now, as for Harvey, I also hope and assume he isn't dead. They never clearly state he is, and I can see him being taken away to Arkham as suggested and people trying to bring him back to normal. As for The Joker, he needs to be in the third movie and hopefully in a big way. It's unfortunate that whoever plays him will have the stigma of following up Heath Ledger's legendary performance, but a Batman movie now without The Joker, I dunno if it could work.

If it CAN work, it can work now because Batman is on the run, so it could give us a relief from The Joker, but if there is to be a fourth movie, that's definitely when The Joker needs to come back into the fold.

I'd love to see Bane, too. Dear God, Bane would be fucking awesome.

And speaking of Arkham and the possibility of more actors playing The Joker, I hope that they do bring The Joker back. I really do. I'd love to see someone take a stab at playing The Joker with a hint of The Joker from Arkham Asylum, because that would make for some awesome scenes. For those of you who haven't read it, that Joker teases Batman all the fucking time and hints at homosexuality quite a bit. It's a really interesting look at The Joker.

Edited July 21, 2008 by Will.

[Synjynpsychobitch]

I was very excited to see DK and it did not disappoint. It was everything I wanted it to be and more. I was sadden as I watched Heath Ledger, knowing I would never see him perform in another film and he would never get the chance to reprise this role, but I was spelled bound also. I've always liked him as an actor, but this performance was stellar. I won't expound on this anymore, for people that are far more knowledgable about the comic and far more geekified about the movie franchise (said with love guys) have already said all there is to say. Just a good all around movie. 10-10.

Edited July 21, 2008 by Synjynpsychobitch

[gunnar hendershow]

This has been an amazing weekend. Despite it being so stressful at work, it's been amazing to see this movie develop into a phenomenon. People were buying tickets 2 times in the same day from me, and others were seeing it for their 2nd time. At 8:15 we had every show up until 10:20 completely sold out, on a Sunday night. I worked the midnight showing, which was definitely awesome to see almost 4,000 people converge at the same place for one movie. This whole weekend was fun, going into the theaters to see bits and pieces of the movie during break, getting to see it before it was released to the public, convincing people they don't want to see Mamma Mia they want to see Dark Knight instead, and of course telling people the next available Dark Knight showing is over 2 hours away. Memories of one of the few weekends at my shitty job at the movie theater that will definitely stick in my mind forever.

Also...

Spoiler: Click here to view

Okay, I think we all know the next movie needs Killer Croc and Man-Bat. And nobody else.

[Mr. X]

Regarding Rachel, and what I think is her future and a possible future plot that I thought of.

Spoiler: Click here to view

I believe that she didn't really get killed and instead, Joker was just fucking around with Batman and Two Face much like both of them did with Commissioner Gordon who they made the Joker think was dead. Somehow, I am hoping that we end up finding out that Rachael was actually in a third environment the entire time and Joker knew that Batman was going for Dent, so he rigged all three of the places (Dent's place, the warehouse, and Rachael's actual location) with explosives, but was only going to detonate both Dent's place and the throw off for Rachael.

Maybe it would be cool if in the next one, Rachael goes all psychotic on Batman for killing Harvey, because it was him that she actually loved, so instead of Joker coming back, we could have a link to the Joker in the form of Rachael.

Spoiler: Click here to view

After seeing the movie again today, you can see an explosion behind Rachel which indicates that her building did blow up. So your idea already doesn't seem to pan out unless she also has some burns and was picked up by some of Joker's thugs/mobsters.

[VerbalPuke]

I ended up succumbing to the hype and went to see the movie with my girlfriend last night. It sucked.

Just kidding. It was pretty good, though I'm not one to anoint it the greatest film ever. I will say that it was the best Batman movie I've ever seen, and probably the best movie based on a comic book that I've ever seen (not that I've seen them all, but I thought blew away any of the Spiderman or X-Men movies).

Heath Ledger was very good in his role, he certainly lived up to the hype. At the same time, the guy that played Harvey Dent was also very good in his role, as was Christian Bale obviously.

I wouldn't say the movie dragged, but the last bits did feel drawn out, probably more because I've always had trouble staying still in a movie theater. And because we both had to pee.

I'd recommend this film to anybody, doesn't matter if they like Batman, comic books, or action, it was good all around.

[livid]

Spoiler: Click here to view

I'm not convinced that Harvey Dent is dead and that Two-Face will be back for the third one. Just because he fell doesn't necessarily mean he's dead. He may have been motionless but that could easily be explained as something else happening other than his death.

It's rather unfortunate that Ledger died as he did an amazing job as The Joker and would've loved to see more of The Joker. Unfortunately I don't see them re-casting the role, if not to simply respect the work and dedication that Ledger put into the character.

And as far as the third one goes, Nolan isn't actually signed on, officially, to another one but I'd imagine that the Warner Bros. will offer him absolutely huge money to do another one after this one opened so big.

Just an amazing movie and I'll be seeing it again tomorrow with some other friends.

[TGC]

Something I noticed in my second viewing yesterday that I didn't notice the first time...

Spoiler: Click here to view

Whoever it was that said you didn't see what happened to Mike Engel after he was kidnapped, you in fact did. He was the person that Batman took out in the building at the end in the joker mask with his mouth ducttaped and the gun ducttaped to his hands. He was the one that allowed Batman to realize the docs were henchman and the clowns were hostages.