The Mafia Discussion Thread

[oldskool]

I don't remember what I did with Metal Gear Mafia 2. It has to be around here somewhere.

[Sir Alan LCSugar]

There is one Mafia game i regret not winning, because i honestly beleive the Mafia we had put in a fantastic performance and only a couple of lucky moves stopped us. That was Mafia III i beleive, which had a Mafia of Beeker, TEOL, MEG, Essa and myself. That was my favourite ever game we analysed our plays to death.

[TEOL]

There is one Mafia game i regret not winning, because i honestly beleive the Mafia we had put in a fantastic performance and only a couple of lucky moves stopped us. That was Mafia III i beleive, which had a Mafia of Beeker, TEOL, MEG, Essa and myself. That was my favourite ever game we analysed our plays to death.

I remember that. We kicked ass, we got screwed over by Zan IIRC

[-A-]

If anyone's starting a sign-up for a mafia game soon, could I possibly get a place? I'm not popping in that often since I'm not in any of the games running at the moment and it's pretty hard to get into one like Pleatherface's when there're only 14 places. The small mafia games are best, too

[Guest Mr. Potato Head]

I'll be starting sign-ups for two small games in two weeks and a day. Check back then. (Y)

[-A-]

Awesome, will keep an eye out.

Was looking through some old games and came across something that still makes me laugh - Stephen King Mafia. 22 players, 8 of them Mafia in one group. No number of obscure clues could have helped us there and by the end I swear even the town was trying to get it over and done with as quickly as possible.

[Mr Evil Guy]

There is one Mafia game i regret not winning, because i honestly beleive the Mafia we had put in a fantastic performance and only a couple of lucky moves stopped us. That was Mafia III i beleive, which had a Mafia of Beeker, TEOL, MEG, Essa and myself. That was my favourite ever game we analysed our plays to death.

I remember that. We kicked ass, we got screwed over by Zan IIRC

Mafia V, it was.

Me and LCS were the last surviving. I remember the big chats we had, we had so much ideas. I remember I framed like two people and had the ability to change peoples abilities but it didn't show after they RIPed(so we are all "ZAN SCREWED US :@") and we convinced people Beeker was town and almost got him mayor, IIRC. I remember we just bounced shit off each other the entire time. It was fun.

It was a draw, and then Zan called GoGo the winner on some shitty point system. Generally a fun game, though.

[Pesci]

Yeah, I was in that draw too as Kaney the Resident Evil freak Zombie Cult leader. Had no idea about it though.

[Josh]

One thing I'd like to point out about the list of previous game survivors (felt this was more appropriate to say in this thread though):

Survival to the end of a game does not necessarily make a good player, and many great players won't survive very long in the games they play, particularly if they're town. Case in point - Pesci in Traditional Mafia IV. He may have got killed early on, but his job as a townie really isn't to survive - something that TGC seems to understand as well, looking at the same game.

Anyway, that probably all goes without saying, but I just thought that players newer to the game should take notice of that. It's also not at all against the standings, as Pesci made a really cool list there that DOES represent some cool accomplishments.

[TEOL]

A useful player, or a player with a useful role, will do well to strive to survive as long as possible, though. That way they can provide the maximum amount of assistance to the town. This is why it annoys me so much when cops claim immediately.

[Plubby]

I agree with Josh-oo-wuh, I still don't rate GoGo anywhere near as highly as I do MPH, or MEG...or Pesci, who I think is the best player here, and it isn't even close.

[Pesci]

Yeah, you're right. I wouldn't say I'm above you or MPH because I have more than double your survivals, for instance. Especially since the town as a whole wins when all the threats have been eliminated, and in theory everybody's played their part. Plus good townie players and analysts will inevitably end up making themselves targets for the Mafia as well. That said, most of my wins do seem to be from when I was either un-nightkillable, protected for a long period of the game by another player or playing as Mafia. It's just fun to keep track of, I guess.

[TEOL]

And then, of course, there are those of us too busy running awesome games to play in them.

Hell, how do you guys know I didn't just modkill Pesci for saying he was better than me?

[Josh]

A useful player, or a player with a useful role, will do well to strive to survive as long as possible, though. That way they can provide the maximum amount of assistance to the town. This is why it annoys me so much when cops claim immediately.

Agreed, at least in terms of role/ability claims. I just don't want anyone to get the impression that survival is the end, as it is instead the means to an end.

[Josh]

Yeah, you're right. I wouldn't say I'm above you or MPH because I have more than double your survivals, for instance. Especially since the town as a whole wins when all the threats have been eliminated, and in theory everybody's played their part. Plus good townie players and analysts will inevitably end up making themselves targets for the Mafia as well. That said, most of my wins do seem to be from when I was either un-nightkillable, protected for a long period of the game by another player or playing as Mafia. It's just fun to keep track of, I guess.

Agreed. It's still very fun to keep track of.

[Pesci]

And then, of course, there are those of us too busy running awesome games to play in them.

Hell, how do you guys know I didn't just modkill Pesci for saying he was better than me?

Pfft, if I could post again in TradMaf I'd take back what I said because TGC turned up town. I obviously just got lucky

[TEOL]

Absolutely. Victory is the goal.

Case in point: the only Trad Maf ever won by the Town was due to Mysterio actively sacrificing himself at a crucial point in the game in order to ensure victory for his team, still one of the most excellent plays I've ever seen.

The biggest problem I have with the Mafia scene at the moment is too many people are unwilling to take risks. Let's face it, no one can really explain why they think someone is scum, but top players just know. They have good instincts. Unfortunately, the EWB way is conditioning people against trusting those instincts, since if you don't have a good enough reason, no one will back to lynch.

[Plubby]

The biggest problem I have with the Mafia scene at the moment is too many people are unwilling to take risks. Let's face it, no one can really explain why they think someone is scum, but top players just know. They have good instincts. Unfortunately, the EWB way is conditioning people against trusting those instincts, since if you don't have a good enough reason, no one will back to lynch.

I agree with this completely - I have actually changed the way I play lately to try and rectify this. TradMaf3 comes to mind as trying to put that into practice. Traditional Mafia is the place where you have to have your instincts turned on because there is nothing to counter the Mafia's incredibly huge fundamental advantage.

[Josh]

Absolutely. Victory is the goal.

Case in point: the only Trad Maf ever won by the Town was due to Mysterio actively sacrificing himself at a crucial point in the game in order to ensure victory for his team, still one of the most excellent plays I've ever seen.

The biggest problem I have with the Mafia scene at the moment is too many people are unwilling to take risks. Let's face it, no one can really explain why they think someone is scum, but top players just know. They have good instincts. Unfortunately, the EWB way is conditioning people against trusting those instincts, since if you don't have a good enough reason, no one will back to lynch.

That raises an interesting question:

Can these instincts be translated into principles of good play that can be taught or acquired through experience?

I believe they can, at least some of the time. For instance, you don't see too many people called out for using WIFOM logic these days, despite the fact that it's often used. Could it be that when one of the better players sees something like that, that is when their "instincts" tell them a player is scum, or at least quite possibly so?

[Mr Evil Guy]

I'm not gonna lie, surviving is my only goal. I don't give a shit if I help the town or not, if I tend to? Cool, great, sweet. But my entire mafia play is to lay low to the end, jump on any lynches so mafia are more clear to see and then we will eventually get some mafia and a better outlook at the end.

It tends to work, if not, meh.

I do agree that people are too hesitant, though. Sometimes I have a large feeling that someone is mafia but I never bother to do it because everyone is all ":| why?" You feel like the biggest cock if you're wrong though.

EDIT: Rephrased.

Edited July 30, 2008 by Mr. Evil Guy