The Mafia Discussion Thread

[TEOL]

Part of the other problem is that EWB has a mentality of "Oh, I'm vanilla. I was hoping for a cool role" and then abandoning the game.

Yeah. That's the mindset that causes game runners to go 'oh shit, I've got to give everyone a power or they won't play' and ends up throwing games out of whack. I don't think it's too bad these days, though, as people either got used to vanilla roles or the people who had that mindset got bored with Mafia as a whole and left.

[Pesci]

And as I said in the game thread, the role WAS incredibly overpowered, but I was confident that I could win it as a standard SK, which was what I had thought I was for the full game until, well, until I unexpectedly won.

The Mafia tried to kill you Night 5. You should have died! I mean seriously, for you to lose, the town pretty much had to investigate you - which wouldn't have happened because of your roleposting. Roleposting serves in making you more safe in the eyes of the town (though it shouldn't) and making you more of a target for the scum (and if it doesn't it should do) because the town basically thinks you're confirmed. The roleclaim was great thinking but the mafia tried to take out somebody they thought was a confirmed townie and couldn't... because fuck me you were like Jesus or something.

[Sousa]

And make it NK proof?

...it was night-kill proof!?

[Pleatherface]

I've tried innovation alot over the years. The day cult. An investigator that remembers every action that went through the night before. Seriously. He got a recap of every action that happened, but no specifics.

A 3 man mafia, consisting of a mimmic (who copied the protector, and used that ability to protect himself.), a night killer, and an investigator.

No don, just a night kill and lynch immunity that they could split between the three of them before the game started.

I've ran with one man mafias, evil twins, mason where both masons were members of a different mafia, the whole nine.

I can't say if any of them were ever successful, because all the games died due to my own inabilty to run a game, but the roles were always balanced out.

[Jimmy]

One day, you should just design a game for someone else to run.

My next game - I think I'm really going to get creative. I've never really done any special except for the SK roles I've given Norro and MPH in the past. I think I was always a little worried of having things balanced or having a kind of over powered role, or something.

I think balancing games can be hard - because you can never predict how I game will run its course.

[The Mask of Norro]

When I make games I try and balance out abilities and numbers to the best of my ability. Go through any possible outcomes to ensure that the game at the very least can go a few nights in without ending. VGCM for example could have ended really quickly if everything went to shit on the town, which was why I used abilities to balance out the difference of having nearly half the players be scum. It worked out, and the town came very close to winning, as did the serial killer who, though he couldn't be killed, was not given a safeclaim nor made investigation proof.

That was one thing now in hindsight that I think I was as well in burny's game. I was a bulletproof serial killer with a safeclaim that turned up in investigations (apparently, since GM got a result that made him think I was Navi after all) who won when endgame was reached. If I was an awful player I could have easily died early, but since I knew what I was doing (just didn't know I didn't have to do much) I was able to plow through the game way too easily due to the nature of the role. This wasn't the Gatekeeper-- the Gatekeeper was at least found out. Apparently this was me being kill and investigation proof, or at the very least kill and thief proof. The only way I could have died was slipping up as a player in-thread and getting myself lynched.

[TGC]

Are you sure you weren't lynch proof too?

[Pleatherface]

Split... That's a damn fine idea. Infact if there's anyone out there that wants a game designed and roles created for them that they pick and choose, use carbon copy, or ignore completely as you wish, let me know with your theme.

[Sousa]

My next game is going to be called Norro Basically Plugs Everyone in the Butt Mafia. 25 players, game is ready because the other 24 roles are irrelevant.

[naiwf]

Is the Norro role like one of those gigantic smutty anime monsters with 20+ "tentacles" and the other 24 roles are busty teenage girls who wear very little clothing?

[The Mask of Norro]

No, no, I'm a Pokemon Master and the other 24 roles are Pokemon. My role has 24 Master Balls to use whenever I want, even at the same time, as an ability. The objective of the 24 other players is to not be caught. I can also use my ability during any phase I choose.

[Your Mom]

My next game is going to be called Norro Basically Plugs Everyone in the Butt Mafia. 25 players, game is ready because the other 24 roles are irrelevant.

Preregister?

[Nick Adams]

In the current design that I'm thinking of for Homestarrunner Mafia, I was thinking of having a mason group. It would make sense due to the characters that I'd use, but I don't know if I really want to do it or not.

[theburninator77]

Basically the town killed all the scum, and the Serial Killer, but included in the game was the retarded Gatekeeper role, where if the Gatekeeper is alive at endgame, everyone else dies and only he wins.

Which is a fine way to reward either side for doing everything they are supposed to do to win the game.

*sigh*

I've already admitted responsibility for making an overpowered role. People need to admit that they made a bungle in falling for MEG (of all people) saying "I'm indi, but I'm on your side!" (which should never, ever be allowed to pass unchecked) and then not lynching a non-town player they'd had served to them on a platter. That game was winnable for the town, but they lynched players in the wrong order.

But this is also the reason no-one trusts survivor indies anymore

Mafia, for a town, shouldn't be about lynching all the scum in the right order - it should just be about lynching scum. Like naiwf said, if people put time and effort into a game, only to have it wasted by a game mechanic that's fatally flawed (like Friends or Marvel Civil War), or a role that no-one can expect (Indy that kills everyone left at endgame), then you are going to get a lot of pissed-off people.

burny, the thing that strikes me as odd about the whole thing is you are clearly aware of GCR and the backlash that came with it - I'm surprised you'd include the same role? And make it NK proof?

It was kind of one of those things that dawned on me after it was too late to stop it... as in the game was already running and I was like "Oh fuck."

When I make games I try and balance out abilities and numbers to the best of my ability. Go through any possible outcomes to ensure that the game at the very least can go a few nights in without ending. VGCM for example could have ended really quickly if everything went to shit on the town, which was why I used abilities to balance out the difference of having nearly half the players be scum. It worked out, and the town came very close to winning, as did the serial killer who, though he couldn't be killed, was not given a safeclaim nor made investigation proof.

That was one thing now in hindsight that I think I was as well in burny's game. I was a bulletproof serial killer with a safeclaim that turned up in investigations (apparently, since GM got a result that made him think I was Navi after all) who won when endgame was reached. If I was an awful player I could have easily died early, but since I knew what I was doing (just didn't know I didn't have to do much) I was able to plow through the game way too easily due to the nature of the role. This wasn't the Gatekeeper-- the Gatekeeper was at least found out. Apparently this was me being kill and investigation proof, or at the very least kill and thief proof. The only way I could have died was slipping up as a player in-thread and getting myself lynched.

Your safeclaim did not turn up in investigations...

What would you expect a thief to steal from Navi?

[The Mask of Norro]

Any number of things. She could fetch Link items in some games, furthermore she spewed a seemingly never ending supply of pixie dust off the sides of her wings. You could be creative with it

One would assume that since GM stole from me he got SOMETHING that implied me being Navi. Unless you said he was unable to steal anything from me, without the Navi safeclaim protecting me, in which case I'd argue you could conceivably steal any number of items from nature, such as twigs, branches, leaves, rocks, pebbles, sand, mud, sap, moss, fungus, grass, or... well, you get the idea

I only assume he was unable to steal anything from me and thus that confirmed to him my being Navi which, once again, I don't see how you can't steal something from nature, so...

[theburninator77]

Nope he was able to steal nature items from you... I guess that was just good enough to pass off as being Navi.

[Sousa]

Pokemon, shit. No, Norris is Hornswoggle and everyone else is Chavo Guerrero.

[Josh]

In the current design that I'm thinking of for Homestarrunner Mafia, I was thinking of having a mason group. It would make sense due to the characters that I'd use, but I don't know if I really want to do it or not.

This is for 15 players, right? Two masons might work, but seems iffy to me. Any more is definitely pushing it. And while I like that you're clearly giving considerable thought to your set-up, you might want to find someone willing to privately help you, so as to avoid giving away in-game details ahead of time.

Pokemon, shit. No, Norris is Hornswoggle and everyone else is Chavo Guerrero.

"You are One-Hand-Tied-Behind-Your-Back Chavo, Chavo Guerrero Aligned Shit, I Just Got One Hand."

"You are Sharp-Dressed-Man Chavo, Chavo Guerrero Aligned I Gotta Talk To My Tailor."

"You are Bullrope-Match Chavo, Chavo Guerrero Aligned Man-Cow If You Weeeeeell."

[Noah]

Im just about to head off to work, it would be nice to have the last few spots filled in the next 8 hours. Then the game can begin in time for the weekend and I shall have lots of time for updates.

[Sousa]

I don't even know what the NRL is. Stop being so Australian.