NFL 2020

[Meacon Keaton]

...don't fire John Elway

[VerbalPuke]

Fuck. I found our GM. 

[VerbalPuke]

Actually, i did some reading and Jerry Reese becoming our GM seems very possible. I'd imagine Ernie Acorsi helps the Fords again and it appears Reese succeeded him. I also get the impression we may target somebody with previous experience. 

I do have questions probably for @B-li Manning. Reese won two Superbowls, it does look like 2007 was his first year so team was probably in place. Also won in 2011, so I'd think he had some hand in that? I looked at his last draft in 2017, and his first four picks all appear to be solid contributors. Considering my team hasn't won a playoff game since 91, what should scare me away? If he could even build a roster that won a division title they'd fucking immediately erect a bronze statue of him. Fuck that. Probably gold. 

Anyway, i know you've been critical of him but is there any chance he did know what he was doing sometimes?

[The Buscher]

2 hours ago, VerbalPuke said:

I do have questions probably for @B-li Manning. Reese won two Superbowls, it does look like 2007 was his first year so team was probably in place. Also won in 2011, so I'd think he had some hand in that? I looked at his last draft in 2017, and his first four picks all appear to be solid contributors. Considering my team hasn't won a playoff game since 91, what should scare me away? If he could even build a roster that won a division title they'd fucking immediately erect a bronze statue of him. Fuck that. Probably gold. 

Anyway, i know you've been critical of him but is there any chance he did know what he was doing sometimes?

Even though the core of the team was intact in 2007, Reese's first draft that year really hit it out of the park.  Seven of the eight picks all had big roles at various points in the 2007 Super Bowl run.  And many contributed long past that.  Steve Smith became a Pro Bowler and multi-year starter.  Kevin Boss immediately replaced Jeremy Shockey the next year and had a couple solid years.  Zak DeOssie transitioned from backup linebacker to long snapper and while there's nothing flashy about a long snapper, a good one can last you a long time and that's a 4th round pick who ended up having a 13 year career with the team, probably would still be playing if not for injury.  And then of course Ahmad Bradshaw, 7th round pick who had six productive years with the team including multiple 1,000 yard seasons.

The problem with Reese is that for as long as he was around, 2007 was by far his most productive drafts.  Most of his drafts would see him do well with the 1st round pick but then get next to nothing after that.  There were numerous 2nd-4th round picks under Reese that failed to stick on the roster more than a season or two.  And guys drafted even later than that that completely washed out of the league after getting cut.  Not saying that you can expect more than a backup from most late round picks, but that most of these guys failed to even get a camp invite anywhere else is kinda telling.

Free agency he was mostly pretty good.  If he's got the cap space he'll be aggressive with filling at least one of the biggest weaknesses through the market.  I can't recall too many bust signings under Reese, his undoing was mostly drafts that produced little to no depth past 2007.

Perhaps Marc Ross was a big reason why the Giants drafts sucked.  He was the Director of College Scouting and and VP of Player Evaluation.  He was one of Reese's right hand men and he got canned at the same time.  If Ross is coming along with Reese I'd be way more concerned.  But he's got a job at NFL Network now so who knows.

[VerbalPuke]

10 minutes ago, B-li Manning said:

Even though the core of the team was intact in 2007, Reese's first draft that year really hit it out of the park.  Seven of the eight picks all had big roles at various points in the 2007 Super Bowl run.  And many contributed long past that.  Steve Smith became a Pro Bowler and multi-year starter.  Kevin Boss immediately replaced Jeremy Shockey the next year and had a couple solid years.  Zak DeOssie transitioned from backup linebacker to long snapper and while there's nothing flashy about a long snapper, a good one can last you a long time and that's a 4th round pick who ended up having a 13 year career with the team, probably would still be playing if not for injury.  And then of course Ahmad Bradshaw, 7th round pick who had six productive years with the team including multiple 1,000 yard seasons.

The problem with Reese is that for as long as he was around, 2007 was by far his most productive drafts.  Most of his drafts would see him do well with the 1st round pick but then get next to nothing after that.  There were numerous 2nd-4th round picks under Reese that failed to stick on the roster more than a season or two.  And guys drafted even later than that that completely washed out of the league after getting cut.  Not saying that you can expect more than a backup from most late round picks, but that most of these guys failed to even get a camp invite anywhere else is kinda telling.

Free agency he was mostly pretty good.  If he's got the cap space he'll be aggressive with filling at least one of the biggest weaknesses through the market.  I can't recall too many bust signings under Reese, his undoing was mostly drafts that produced little to no depth past 2007.

Perhaps Marc Ross was a big reason why the Giants drafts sucked.  He was the Director of College Scouting and and VP of Player Evaluation.  He was one of Reese's right hand men and he got canned at the same time.  If Ross is coming along with Reese I'd be way more concerned.  But he's got a job at NFL Network now so who knows.

Thanks, thats all good info. Obviously Reese to Detroit hasn't happened yet, but it wouldn't surprise me. It just feels like an obvious move (even if it may not be right). Also a lot of signs pointing to Robert Saleh as coach as well.

[gunnar hendershow]

58 minutes ago, B-li Manning said:

Even though the core of the team was intact in 2007, Reese's first draft that year really hit it out of the park.  Seven of the eight picks all had big roles at various points in the 2007 Super Bowl run.  And many contributed long past that.  Steve Smith became a Pro Bowler and multi-year starter.  Kevin Boss immediately replaced Jeremy Shockey the next year and had a couple solid years.  Zak DeOssie transitioned from backup linebacker to long snapper and while there's nothing flashy about a long snapper, a good one can last you a long time and that's a 4th round pick who ended up having a 13 year career with the team, probably would still be playing if not for injury.  And then of course Ahmad Bradshaw, 7th round pick who had six productive years with the team including multiple 1,000 yard seasons.

The problem with Reese is that for as long as he was around, 2007 was by far his most productive drafts.  Most of his drafts would see him do well with the 1st round pick but then get next to nothing after that.  There were numerous 2nd-4th round picks under Reese that failed to stick on the roster more than a season or two.  And guys drafted even later than that that completely washed out of the league after getting cut.  Not saying that you can expect more than a backup from most late round picks, but that most of these guys failed to even get a camp invite anywhere else is kinda telling.

Free agency he was mostly pretty good.  If he's got the cap space he'll be aggressive with filling at least one of the biggest weaknesses through the market.  I can't recall too many bust signings under Reese, his undoing was mostly drafts that produced little to no depth past 2007.

Perhaps Marc Ross was a big reason why the Giants drafts sucked.  He was the Director of College Scouting and and VP of Player Evaluation.  He was one of Reese's right hand men and he got canned at the same time.  If Ross is coming along with Reese I'd be way more concerned.  But he's got a job at NFL Network now so who knows.

I think while the GM makes the final decision with regard to drafting it's all about having a good college scouting and player evaluation team with them. GM's can still have that and flub drafts by getting cute (the Jets taking Jamal Adams instead of Mahomes because they liked QBs in the following draft is a prime example of this, great scouting on Adams but they passed on the best QB in the league). The better the information the GM has, the less likely they are to make the wrong choice.

47 minutes ago, VerbalPuke said:

Thanks, thats all good info. Obviously Reese to Detroit hasn't happened yet, but it wouldn't surprise me. It just feels like an obvious move (even if it may not be right). Also a lot of signs pointing to Robert Saleh as coach as well.

That would be a fantastic hire and if I recall he's from Dearborn, no?

Neat thing about that hire, if it comes to pass, is because SF developed him they'll get multiple draft picks.

[DFF]

Tbh, with our run of GMs Reece sounds an upgrade 😅

[DYSI]

53 minutes ago, VerbalPuke said:

Thanks, thats all good info. Obviously Reese to Detroit hasn't happened yet, but it wouldn't surprise me. It just feels like an obvious move (even if it may not be right). Also a lot of signs pointing to Robert Saleh as coach as well.

 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/nyg/draft.htm

Is a good look at what you might be in for if you do hire Reese. I think his draft tenure was from '08-'16 if I'm not mistaken.

 

He had some hits early but A LOT more misses. Specifically the 2011-2013 drafts, if he didn't hit on OBJ in 2014 he probably would've been gone a lot quicker than he was. He hit on Landon Collins the year after and Sterling Shepard - but outside those two 2nd rounders he missed just about everything else. However, Engram, Tomlinson, and Gallman from his last draft are still around but Engram (esp. since Kittle was drafted 146th overall) wasn't a popular choice as a luxury TE with all our problems on the OL.

 

 

Edited December 12, 2020 by DYSI

[VerbalPuke]

33 minutes ago, damshow said:

I think while the GM makes the final decision with regard to drafting it's all about having a good college scouting and player evaluation team with them. GM's can still have that and flub drafts by getting cute (the Jets taking Jamal Adams instead of Mahomes because they liked QBs in the following draft is a prime example of this, great scouting on Adams but they passed on the best QB in the league). The better the information the GM has, the less likely they are to make the wrong choice.

That would be a fantastic hire and if I recall he's from Dearborn, no?

Neat thing about that hire, if it comes to pass, is because SF developed him they'll get multiple draft picks.

Yeah he is from Dearborn and is still tied heavily to the community. It just seems like local media have picked up on it, and Saleh himself seemed interested in coming home. I'd be cool with him, Richard Sherman had a great endorsement of him a week or so back.

It could all shake out differently but we could do worse than Reese/Saleh I'd think. It just feels like that is the most likely direction for Detroit. 

[VerbalPuke]

31 minutes ago, DYSI said:

 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/nyg/draft.htm

Is a good look at what you might be in for if you do hire Reese. I think his draft tenure was from '08-'16 if I'm not mistaken.

 

He had some hits early but A LOT more misses. Specifically the 2011-2013 drafts, if he didn't hit on OBJ in 2014 he probably would've been gone a lot quicker than he was. He hit on Landon Collins the year after and Sterling Shepard - but outside those two 2nd rounders he missed just about everything else. However, Engram, Tomlinson, and Gallman from his last draft are still around but Engram (esp. since Kittle was drafted 146th overall) wasn't a popular choice as a luxury TE with all our problems on the OL.

 

 

Yeah I actually went through and looked his drafts last night because that's where I really judge player acquisition. I don't know, guess we'll see. I could be way off and he goes elsewhere. 

[Maxx]

 

 

[Adam]

This is the best the Cardinals Defense has played in literally years. If we had some Red Zone efficiency we'd be out of sight by now, but the Giants have hung in there.

[The Buscher]

Despite the recent win streak, anyone whose watched the Giants all year knows that their offense doesn’t have it in them to overcome a two TD deficit.  Especially since  Jones is clearly still hurt and can’t run.

Feel like they’re pretty much already screwed today unless they get a defensive TD or a turnover that gifts them a drive starting in the red zone or something.

[Lineker]

Watson down  

[Krabby]

Whats it like to have a kicker that makes kicks?

[The Buscher]

Two weeks ago I’d have said zero chance of winning in Seattle but decent chance of beating Arizona who haven’t played well of late.

This league has a way of evening things out.

[Maxx]

Giovani Bernard fumbled for the first time since 2013, and he was immediately benched.

[Adam]

Needed that win. Still in the Play-Off hunt.

Haason Reddick with five sacks (a franchise record) and three forced fumbles today. Unreal.

[The Buscher]

Lot of good to say about Joe Judge this year but playing Daniel Jones today when he clearly couldn’t move around was inexcusable.

Jones’ ability to make plays is reliant on the threat of his mobility.  Forced stay confined to the pocket, he is a bottom 10 starting QB in the league.

[gunnar hendershow]

Well if the scores hold all teams in the NFC (l)East will be within a game of each other.